[Leica] Zeiss Wide Angle 35mm f/2 Biogon T* ZM

[mark at rabinergroup.com (Mark Rabiner)]

> Wendy,
> 
> Yeah, it shouldn't be controversial.  You asked for opinions on an m-
> mount lens and got a range of impressions and advice from different
> people, which you can use or disregard as you see fit.  That's how
> it's supposed to work, anyway.  Of course, everyone's criteria or
> calculus for making decisions like this is different (for some it's
> cost, for others a specific aspect of image quality, for others
> ergonomics, etc., etc.), so I trust all the substantive responses are
> written merely in the spirit of providing you with information about
> our experiences in actual use, rather than some foregone conclusion
> (based on prejudices, assumptions, and untested general principles)
> that is baby-fed to you.
> 
> My strongly worded post was not due to your query, nor the real topic,
> nor even people who have used the Biogon and hated it or have a
> different experience than mine.  (It's not a religious topic with
> me.)  I only object to the aggressive, dismissive tone Mark used
> because he assumed (wrongly) that I was new and unknowledgeable.  That
> sort of condescending, almost intimidating, tone leveled at a presumed
> newcomer is saddening and only serves to cement certain stereotypes
> about Leica users -- my post was directed solely at that attitude, not
> your question.  :)
> 
> 
> Kevin
> 
> =============
> Only connect.
> =============
> my photography:
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/shudaizi/
> 
> bamboozld at gmail.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Feb 27, 2010, at 12:01 AM, Wendy Thurman wrote:
> 
>> I didn't realize this was such a controversial subject!
>> 
>> Wendy
>> 
>> On Sat, Feb 27, 2010 at 12:01 PM, K Landdeck <bamboozld at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> Mark,
>>> 
>>> I have been on list for quite a while (though I don't post often as
>>> I'm
>>> quite busy writing my dissertation), so no welcome necessary, but I
>>> will say
>>> that attitudes such as yours are why I have almost unsubbed from
>>> this list
>>> multiple times in the past year: thank you so much for your
>>> condescending
>>> attitude ("warp dimension"??).
>>> 
>>> My post was full of "Zeiss this and Zeiss that" because that's what
>>> Wendy
>>> asked for.  Unlike your post (which is based on a second-hand
>>> assessment of
>>> production facilities, outright speculation and comparison with
>>> equipment
>>> made decades ago), I actually have used the Biogon lens extensively
>>> and have
>>> used my Leica Summicron 35 ASPH extensively as well (though I
>>> haven't had it
>>> as long as the Biogon).  I am speaking from experience on both
>>> sides and
>>> make direct comparisons based on that experience of use, looking at
>>> the
>>> RESULTS I have gotten from both lenses.  And, you will note (or
>>> would if you
>>> actually read my post fully) that I acknowledged both positives and
>>> negatives of the Biogon.
>>> 
>>> You are welcome to your opinions that are based on price-prejudice
>>> and
>>> absolutely no experience with the specific items in question -- I
>>> prefer to
>>> actually have experience with something before I pipe in and when I
>>> do so it
>>> will be my honest and balanced opinion (to the best of my
>>> abilities). :-)
>>> 
>>> All Best,
>>> 
>>> Kevin
>>> 
>>> =============
>>> Only connect.
>>> =============
>>> 
>>> my photography:
>>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/shudaizi/
>>> 
>>> bamboozld at gmail.com
>>> 
>>> Welcome to the LUG Kevin, the ZM Biogon 35 a very nice lens made by
>>>> the very nice largest lens company in the world located in Japan.
>>>> Its a ZM lens we refer to on the LUG.
>>>> It cost a thousand dollars.
>>>> A Summicron cost three thousand dollars.
>>>> You want to compare them straight across you think that's wise?
>>>> The ZM lenses are made in the same faculty that twenty other major
>>>> brand named lenes are made. Within viewing distance of each other.
>>>> Your post is full of Zeiss lenses are this and  Zeiss lenses  are
>>>> that. A Zeiss lens cost three thousand or more dollars and are made
>>>> in Germany with high tolerances amazingly high quality control and
>>>> expensive choice glass types. For a hundred years.
>>>> I own a half dozen for my Hasselblad system.
>>>> The feel, look and quality has no resemblance at all to the nifty
>>>> cheep stuff Cosina makes for them in Japan - with the Zeiss name on
>>>> it. You want to call them a Zeiss lens you're fooling nobody but
>>>> yourself. In another time warp dimension can you compare something
>>>> straight across which cost a three times difference. Is made to way
>>>> less tolerances. Well less quality glasses. Designed for an entirely
>>>> different market. You want to save money?
>>>> Get a CV or ZM lens for your Leica.
>>>> You want a "world glass optic" you have to pay some real Leica money
>>>> for it.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> [Rabs]
>>>> Mark William Rabiner
>>>> 
>>> 


What stereotypes of Leica users might these be Kevin?



[Rabs]
Mark William Rabiner